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bryanzhang's review
3.0
Immediate thoughts upon finishing.
It begins. The first two of Proust's seven volumes are the most well-regarded, and indeed, this third volume is an order less compelling and less controlled, more disorganized and scattered, and takes some effort (and perhaps a bit of lazy skimming) to get through. There is just a lot going on.
The narrator seems to be coming to an age where he is entering society. He no longer spends time attached to his beloved grandmother, or trying to impress Gilberte's parents so that he can continue spending time with her. He makes an extended visit to his dear friend Saint-Loup at some military facility. He finds out that Saint-Loup is "in love" with a prostitute that he himself used to visit, about whose past Saint-Loup knows nothing, and upon whom Saint-Loup showers extremely expensive gifts far beyond what that girl used to be worth in her brothel. He observes the disparity between the expectations that we build up for other people in our imagination, and who they really are.
The premise of the narrator's visit to Saint-Loup is to ask for Saint-Loup's help in getting a connection to his beautiful aristocratic aunt(?) whom he sees strolling outside all the time. In fact, there are a few strands of the narrator's interest in girls throughout the book, all of which are total wastes of time. Proust does a decent job exploring the frivolity and silly passions that Saint-Loup goes through, but every time he tries to explore passion, love, and sensuality through the perspective of the narrator and with respect to girls or women, it feels contrived. There is the one-sided crush he has on the Duchesse de Guermantes, and the random episode with the reappearing and then disappearing Albertine, and his being stood up by Mlle. de Stermaria. Presumably the latter two girls will make more appearances in the future, and so I have to withhold too much judgment here, because in such a sprawling work it's only fair to allow some preparatory time. But at least in the context of this single volume, the episodes seem boring, and the narrator's subsequent thoughts seem unconvincing.
There is something of a repeated structure that occurs in the two "books" into which this volume is divided. In both, there is an agonizingly long salon conversation (first in the house of the less-esteemed Villeparisis, and then in the house of the beautiful and fashionable Madame de Guermantes). Across the total 800 pages in this volume, I'd guess maybe 300 are dedicated to these two conversations, where multiple people constantly talk over each other about nothing at all. The Dreyfus affair sits underneath everything, and there's a lot of gossip, and talk of heritages and bloodlines and aristocracy, and other meaningless stuff. But then after each conversation comes an episode that brings in death: after the first, the narrator's grandmother falls ill, and for several weeks we watch as she gradually weakens and finally dies. This is of course devastating to the narrator, and dealing with the obnoxious aristocrats around him (like the Monsieur de Guermantes who intrudes upon the narrator's grieving mother because he thinks everyone should be honored that he has come to pay his respects) also puts in relief the immense frivolity that he witnessed listening to the pointless conversations in Villeparisis's drawing room. Similarly in the second instance, the familiar Charles Swann, who has played such a pivotal role in the narrator's early life, and throughout the first two volumes, comes to visit M. and Mme. de Guermantes as they prepare to head out for a night out. At the end of a friendly conversation, as the couple are leaving, Mme. de Guermantes insistently invites Swann to join them on a trip to Italy in about a year until he finally reveals (well, the narrator does note that he looks very weak and sick) that he is dying, and will be several months dead by then. Mme. de Guermantes does not know how to react - she is in a hurry to get in her carriage and go to her party - so she tries to make light of it, promises they will discuss this later, until her husband points out she is wearing mismatched shoes for her dress, and that there is plenty of time for her to go back inside and change her shoes.
These two episodes grounded in death against the absurd and comic ways of the dying French aristocracy serve as the highlights of the volume, but overall there are just too many issues that prevent me from totally enjoying this one:
- The French aristocracy is a major piece of the setting for this volume, but the two salon conversations are so long and inane that the only way to get through them is to not. I found myself skipping pages of dialogue and am convinced that I made the right decision and have lost almost nothing in the reading experience except frustration.
- Proust's comparisons, metaphors, and images are less delightful, impressive, and pervasive as they used to be. If you wanted to highlight the best parts of his prose, you could reasonably do that. If you tried to do that with the first two volumes, you'd just end up highlighting the whole book.
- The narrator is unbelievably charming and popular. Everyone at the military facility loves him and wants him to come back, Saint-Loup is unbelievably patient and caring with the narrator's frailty, everyone at Villeparisis's loves him, somehow he unintentionally attracted the attentions of the incredibly passionate and perhaps predatory M. de Charlus, everyone always seems to speak very good things of him, and he even gets invited another level up to a party held by the very esteemed Princesse de Guermantes (oh by the way, it's impossible to keep up with all the titles and names used in this volume). We have to have some mercy here because it provides the pretext for the narrator being able to observe so much of what goes on in aristocratic French society, but considering that the narrator seems to be mostly a stand-in for Proust himself, it does feel a bit weird.
Nevertheless, the volume is still frustratingly rife with cute little observations on people and their relationships and the silly ways we behave, and quiet meditations on life and loneliness and love, plus some interesting discussions about art and snobbishness and society, so that even if it can be a real chore to get through, each little nugget of gold is proof that Proust is still worth getting through, even if he chooses to hide them beneath hundreds of pages of silt.
In other news, I have moved on from trying to obtain the older hardcover copies of the original CKSM translation and have resigned myself to the revised translation that is currently being printed in paperback by the Modern Library. I definitely have also started to feel the burden of CKSM's rather circuitous style of prose, and am hoping I will have a better time with the revised edition.
Meanwhile I dropped Moby Dick about 75% of the way through and I promise to finish it sooner or later.
It begins. The first two of Proust's seven volumes are the most well-regarded, and indeed, this third volume is an order less compelling and less controlled, more disorganized and scattered, and takes some effort (and perhaps a bit of lazy skimming) to get through. There is just a lot going on.
The narrator seems to be coming to an age where he is entering society. He no longer spends time attached to his beloved grandmother, or trying to impress Gilberte's parents so that he can continue spending time with her. He makes an extended visit to his dear friend Saint-Loup at some military facility. He finds out that Saint-Loup is "in love" with a prostitute that he himself used to visit, about whose past Saint-Loup knows nothing, and upon whom Saint-Loup showers extremely expensive gifts far beyond what that girl used to be worth in her brothel. He observes the disparity between the expectations that we build up for other people in our imagination, and who they really are.
The premise of the narrator's visit to Saint-Loup is to ask for Saint-Loup's help in getting a connection to his beautiful aristocratic aunt(?) whom he sees strolling outside all the time. In fact, there are a few strands of the narrator's interest in girls throughout the book, all of which are total wastes of time. Proust does a decent job exploring the frivolity and silly passions that Saint-Loup goes through, but every time he tries to explore passion, love, and sensuality through the perspective of the narrator and with respect to girls or women, it feels contrived. There is the one-sided crush he has on the Duchesse de Guermantes, and the random episode with the reappearing and then disappearing Albertine, and his being stood up by Mlle. de Stermaria. Presumably the latter two girls will make more appearances in the future, and so I have to withhold too much judgment here, because in such a sprawling work it's only fair to allow some preparatory time. But at least in the context of this single volume, the episodes seem boring, and the narrator's subsequent thoughts seem unconvincing.
There is something of a repeated structure that occurs in the two "books" into which this volume is divided. In both, there is an agonizingly long salon conversation (first in the house of the less-esteemed Villeparisis, and then in the house of the beautiful and fashionable Madame de Guermantes). Across the total 800 pages in this volume, I'd guess maybe 300 are dedicated to these two conversations, where multiple people constantly talk over each other about nothing at all. The Dreyfus affair sits underneath everything, and there's a lot of gossip, and talk of heritages and bloodlines and aristocracy, and other meaningless stuff. But then after each conversation comes an episode that brings in death: after the first, the narrator's grandmother falls ill, and for several weeks we watch as she gradually weakens and finally dies. This is of course devastating to the narrator, and dealing with the obnoxious aristocrats around him (like the Monsieur de Guermantes who intrudes upon the narrator's grieving mother because he thinks everyone should be honored that he has come to pay his respects) also puts in relief the immense frivolity that he witnessed listening to the pointless conversations in Villeparisis's drawing room. Similarly in the second instance, the familiar Charles Swann, who has played such a pivotal role in the narrator's early life, and throughout the first two volumes, comes to visit M. and Mme. de Guermantes as they prepare to head out for a night out. At the end of a friendly conversation, as the couple are leaving, Mme. de Guermantes insistently invites Swann to join them on a trip to Italy in about a year until he finally reveals (well, the narrator does note that he looks very weak and sick) that he is dying, and will be several months dead by then. Mme. de Guermantes does not know how to react - she is in a hurry to get in her carriage and go to her party - so she tries to make light of it, promises they will discuss this later, until her husband points out she is wearing mismatched shoes for her dress, and that there is plenty of time for her to go back inside and change her shoes.
These two episodes grounded in death against the absurd and comic ways of the dying French aristocracy serve as the highlights of the volume, but overall there are just too many issues that prevent me from totally enjoying this one:
- The French aristocracy is a major piece of the setting for this volume, but the two salon conversations are so long and inane that the only way to get through them is to not. I found myself skipping pages of dialogue and am convinced that I made the right decision and have lost almost nothing in the reading experience except frustration.
- Proust's comparisons, metaphors, and images are less delightful, impressive, and pervasive as they used to be. If you wanted to highlight the best parts of his prose, you could reasonably do that. If you tried to do that with the first two volumes, you'd just end up highlighting the whole book.
- The narrator is unbelievably charming and popular. Everyone at the military facility loves him and wants him to come back, Saint-Loup is unbelievably patient and caring with the narrator's frailty, everyone at Villeparisis's loves him, somehow he unintentionally attracted the attentions of the incredibly passionate and perhaps predatory M. de Charlus, everyone always seems to speak very good things of him, and he even gets invited another level up to a party held by the very esteemed Princesse de Guermantes (oh by the way, it's impossible to keep up with all the titles and names used in this volume). We have to have some mercy here because it provides the pretext for the narrator being able to observe so much of what goes on in aristocratic French society, but considering that the narrator seems to be mostly a stand-in for Proust himself, it does feel a bit weird.
Nevertheless, the volume is still frustratingly rife with cute little observations on people and their relationships and the silly ways we behave, and quiet meditations on life and loneliness and love, plus some interesting discussions about art and snobbishness and society, so that even if it can be a real chore to get through, each little nugget of gold is proof that Proust is still worth getting through, even if he chooses to hide them beneath hundreds of pages of silt.
In other news, I have moved on from trying to obtain the older hardcover copies of the original CKSM translation and have resigned myself to the revised translation that is currently being printed in paperback by the Modern Library. I definitely have also started to feel the burden of CKSM's rather circuitous style of prose, and am hoping I will have a better time with the revised edition.
Meanwhile I dropped Moby Dick about 75% of the way through and I promise to finish it sooner or later.
kippenautomat's review against another edition
5.0
marcel proust has two moods: being horny and talking about the dreyfus affair
grayjay's review against another edition
3.0
The story opens with the narrator's family having moved from Combray to an apartment connected to the Guermantes' residence. The narrator becomes fascinated with their life, and in love with Mme de Guermantes, cherishing every encounter with her, while assuming she despises every encounter with him.
His best friend, Saint-Loup, is actually the nephew of Mme de Guermantes, so he decides to take a holiday at the barracks Saint-Loup is stationed at. He carrouses, shows off his intellect, and makes some very homoerotic friendships with Saint-Loup's friends. His secret motive is to convince Saint-Loup to talk him up to Mme de Guermantes.
At this point it is starting to seem that the narrator's "love" for this glamorous older woman is a kind of self-sabotage. Is he in love with an unreachable woman because he'd rather be with one of the young male friends he has such intimate connections with?
The narrator is introduced to Saint-Loup's mistress whom he realizes is a prostitute that he has slept with before--awkward!
Finally he manages to get an invitation to Mme de Guermantes' salon, although by that time he has fallen out of love with her. Most of the book is spent in her salons listening to fashionable repartee.
His best friend, Saint-Loup, is actually the nephew of Mme de Guermantes, so he decides to take a holiday at the barracks Saint-Loup is stationed at. He carrouses, shows off his intellect, and makes some very homoerotic friendships with Saint-Loup's friends. His secret motive is to convince Saint-Loup to talk him up to Mme de Guermantes.
At this point it is starting to seem that the narrator's "love" for this glamorous older woman is a kind of self-sabotage. Is he in love with an unreachable woman because he'd rather be with one of the young male friends he has such intimate connections with?
The narrator is introduced to Saint-Loup's mistress whom he realizes is a prostitute that he has slept with before--awkward!
Finally he manages to get an invitation to Mme de Guermantes' salon, although by that time he has fallen out of love with her. Most of the book is spent in her salons listening to fashionable repartee.
casparb's review against another edition
Back to Proust heres vol.3 & what a joy! To be with him again. It's been a couple years since I hit volume two which was a struggle at the time so there was some consternation going in but amazing amazing work Proust is the scholar of memory & here he is remembering
Words do not change their meaning over the centuries as much as names do for us in the space of a few years. Our memories and our hearts are not large enough to remain faithful. We have not room enough, in our present mental space, to keep the dead alongside the living. We are obliged to build on top of what has gone before and is unearthed only by a chance excavation
531
Words do not change their meaning over the centuries as much as names do for us in the space of a few years. Our memories and our hearts are not large enough to remain faithful. We have not room enough, in our present mental space, to keep the dead alongside the living. We are obliged to build on top of what has gone before and is unearthed only by a chance excavation
531
nearnik's review against another edition
informative
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.25
chicokc's review against another edition
4.0
Balbec quedó atrás y es hora de participar en las reuniones con la gente de la realeza, la gente de abolengo, las fiestas, visitas, paseos y reuniones. Las intrigas y el "de quién se enamoró fulano de tal".
El libro sirve para poderte dar la idea de las familias ricachonas de finales del siglo XIX e inicios del XX, esos tiempos en los que la leontina era un artículo común. Se mencionan a las mujeres en flor y a la antigua enamorada de Régulo, pero pasa muy por encima.
El libro sirve para poderte dar la idea de las familias ricachonas de finales del siglo XIX e inicios del XX, esos tiempos en los que la leontina era un artículo común. Se mencionan a las mujeres en flor y a la antigua enamorada de Régulo, pero pasa muy por encima.
suchasuckerforbooks's review
challenging
funny
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? No
3.0
bwood95's review
challenging
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
5.0
andrea12's review
adventurous
funny
mysterious
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.75